… da revisionare …
(questa pagina è in Inglese perché corrisponde ad una mail da me inviata ad una possibile corrispondenza DNA che vive negli USA, di seguito indicata con AJP.
La persona da me contattata è la nonna della detta corrispondenza
Di seguito i nomi di persone viventi vengono indicati solo con le iniziali).
Content
- What we are looking for?
- The Starting Point
- The Peri Family
- Some Speculation and Assumptions
- Conslusion and Next Steps
What we are looking for?
First of all, we should set the right expectation and not to delude anyone later: the DNA match between AJP and me is very small (0,2%) and also MyHeritage says that we are maybe 3rd or much distant cousin.
With 0,2% DNA in common, I guess that if we have an ancestor in common, it should be approximately 9 generations back, i.e. in year 1793 to 1838… very very back in time.
So, what we are looking for is our MRCA, i.e. our Most Recent Common Ancestor… and maybe we have even two of them!
What is intriguing for me and the reason why I contacted AJP‘s grandma is that according to MyHeritage she has a DNA match with two people: MFA and MAZ and those two people have a match:
- the first with my mother and
- the second with my father.
I tested both my parents: they are not related! (More about this later).
The Starting Point
Starting point is our DNA match on MyHeritage:
and the four DNA matches we have in common:
| Estimated Relationship with RSG | Shared Match | Estimated Relationship with AJP | ||
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Relationship | % shared DNA | % shared DNA | Relationship | |
| Mother | 43,9% (3.453,1 cM) | My Mother | 0,4% (26,6 cM) | 3rd-5th cousin |
| 3rd cousin – distant cousin | 0,4% (27,6 cM) | MFA | 0,1% (9,9 cM) | 3rd cousin – distant cousin |
| 3rd cousin – distant cousin | 0,3% (21,2 cM) | MAZ | 0,1% (8,6 cM) | 3rd cousin – distant cousin |
| 3rd cousin – distant cousin | 0,2% (13,6 cM) | PMA | 0,2% (12,0 cM) | 3rd cousin – distant cousin |
My Mother
As a matter of fact, she is related with one of the Fazi Family (see later MFA).
The Fazi Family
As of now I don’t know if MFA is really related to me, but as you can see in the picture below, my grand-grand-grand-mother name is Mariangela Fazi, i.e. the same surname, so most probably related to my mother and me.
I already contacted the person managing her DNA to check the relationship. He/she didn’t answer yet. I’m still hoping to get an answer soon.
This branch of my family comes from the region Marche, province Ascoli Piceno, mainly from the town Acquasanta Terme or nearby.
I believe this could be really a link between me and AJP.
To-Do: at the City Office of Acquasanta Terme as well as at the Parrishes there and nearby (Quintodecimo, Paggese, Santa Maria) search for some documents about Mariangela Fazi.
The Azzarello Family
Now things get complicated.
At the current status of my research, I don’t have the surname Azzarello on my family tree. However, it sounds to me South-Italian.
As a matter of fact, MAZ seems to have a DNA match with my father, whose ancestors came from Sicily, from the province of Catania (near the Etna volcano, mainly between Zafferana Etnea and Acireale) and from the province of Messina, from the city itself and from Taormina.
| Estimated Relationship with RSG | Shared Match | Estimated Relationship with MAZ | ||
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Relationship | % shared DNA | % shared DNA | Relationship | |
| Father | 49,9% (3.537,2 cM) | My Father | 0,2% (11,2 cM) | 3rd-5th cousin |
As one can see in the picture on the right, the surname Azzarello is most common in Sicily, so maybe is there the link!
I have also a theory based on my surname and a match I have on FamilyTreeDna with a man, RJM, who is among others looking for the surname Greco.
According to my theory, it might be that my ancestors came, probably more than 200 years ago from the region Calabria.
In the picture below is part of RJM’s family tree with Anna Greco and Domenico Greco, both coming from a town called Orti (no, you won’t find it in Wikipedia) in the province of Reggio Calabria, in the Italian region Calabria.
My surname (Greco) is very common in Calabria. Not only, also are the name Anna and Domenico common between my ancestors.
It is know that in the past in Italy (but not only), they used to give to babies the name of the grandpas or grandmas or uncles or aunts, so that in many families one can find usually many ancestors with the same name. This fact strengthens my theory.
The Martello Family
Another DNA match AJP and me have in common is with PMA.
| Estimated Relationship with RSG | Shared Match | Estimated Relationship with PMA | ||
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Relationship | % shared DNA | % shared DNA | Relationship | |
| Father | 49,9% (3.537,2 cM) | My Father | 0,2% (13,5 cM) | 3rd cousin – distant cousin |
| Daughter | 48,4% (3.512,3 cM) | My Daughter | 0,3% (20,2 cM) | 3rd cousin – distant cousin |
| 3rd cousin – distant cousin | 0,1% (10,2 cM) | PTA | 0,2% (17,1 cM) | 3rd cousin – distant cousin |
PMA has a DNA match also with my father and with my daughter. Unfortunately he doesn’t have a family tree on MyHeritage, so I couldn’t check any information about his family.
Anyway, as one can see in the picture on the right, also the surname Martello is very common in Sicily.
I will contact PMA and hopefully he will tell me more about his ancestors.
However, looking at the matches I have in common with PMA, I noticed also one surname, I already encountered researching another DNA Match: the surname Tanti, for that see the corresponding section in The Possible Connection with the Portelli Family. Also this branch is on the side of my grandparents, i.e. from South-Italy.
The Peri Family
As of now, I don’t have the surname Peri, i.e. AJP‘s surname, in my family tree.
However, if it is correct what I said at the beginning, that we have to look 8 or more generations ago, i.e. 200 or 300 years ago, it is very probable that the surname changed also many times because they are passed only on the paternal side.
Update 23-Nov-2018: The Lo Pinto Connection
Looking for my connections to SDR (see again The Possible Connection with the Portelli Family) I analyzed her family tree and encountered the surname Lo Pinto:
Please note, that branch of SDR‘s family tree is mostly originary from Malta, which until 1964 was part of the British empire.
Now, why am I talking about the Lo Pinto family? Let’s have a look at the (small) Italian branch of AJP‘s family tree:
We know that AJP‘s grandfather was Joseph Sr. Peri and we know that her grandmother’s name was Rose, however until now we didn’t know her surname.
Some Speculation and Assumptions
Now, ancestry.com suggested me a document (source Index to Marriages, New York City Clerk’s Office, New York, New York.), where we found that
- Rose Lo Pinto
- married on 30th August 1926
- Joseph Di Peri
Assuming the change of surname from “Di Peri” in simply “Peri” (as I saw often with Italian surnames loosing the “Di”, “De”, etc. including “Lo”, see later), there is a high chance that they are AJP‘s grandparents!
The last step now would be to find a link between Rose Lo Pinto and the Lo Pinto family in SDR branch and of course between me and SDR.
Once confirmed this last step and my relatedness with SDR and her family, this could be one of the link between me and AJP.
Some More Names
Assuming the above is correct, ancestry.com also suggested other information important for exploring the branch and finding a link: the parents of the above mentioned Rose could be: Frank Pinto and Maria Concetta (surname unknown).
Conclusion and Next Steps
As of now, there are many paths to follow for finding the link between AJP and me, thus confirming the DNA-correspondence, the paths going through the families Fazi, Azzarello, Martello and Tanti, Lo Pinto.
Again, it might be that the results of all researches will lead to the conclusion that such a DNA-correspondence is just a “background noise” of the DNA-analysis, i.e. there might be no relatedness at all between us. Genetic may be an help, but it must be supported by other evidences.
DNA-Match
AJP, from USA, has a DNA-Match with me on
- myheritage: 12,1 cM (longest one 12,1 cM) across 1 segment, possible 3th to distant cousin.
Following table shows the possible relationship to our MRCA (Most Recent Common Ancestor). In parenthesis the less probable surnames, reported here just for sake of completeness and because DNA-matches and family trees are often not so precise or reliable.
| My family | MRCA | AJP’s family |
|---|---|---|
| Because the percentage of common DNA is so small, the MRCA goes back much more generations than I have in my tree and she has in her tree. See also The Possible Connection with the Peri Family. |
||
| My 4x-great-grandparents: Cognoli + Sermarini, Cognoli + Del Grande, Cognoli + Guerrieri, Orsini + Quaglia (Massetti + Fazi, Di Lorenzo + Bellini) |
Siblings? | AJP’s 4x-great-grandparents |
| My 3x-great-grandparents: Cognoli + Del Grande, Cognoli + Guerrieri, Orsini + Quaglia (Massetti + Fazi, Di Lorenzo + Bellini) |
Siblings or 1st cousins? | AJP’s 3x-great-grandparents: |
| My 2x-great-grandparents: Cognoli + Guerrieri, Orsini + Quaglia (Massetti + Fazi, Di Lorenzo + Bellini) |
Siblings or 2nd cousins? | AJP’s 2x-great-grandparents. |
| My great-grandparents: Cognoli + Orsini (Massetti + Di Lorenzo) |
1st or 3rd cousins? | AJP’s great-grandparents: Joseph Peri Sr., Rose Peri (b. ???) |
| My grandfather: Cognoli (My grandmother: Massetti) |
2nd or 4th cousins? | AJP’s grandparents |
| My mother | 3rd or 5th cousins? | AJP’s parents |
| Me | 4th or 6th cousins? | AJP |
Thus, according to the table above, AJP and I should be
- 3rd cousin, if …,
- 4th cousin, if …,
- 5th cousin, if …,
- 6th cousin, if …
Location
The few ancestors AJP has in her tree have no indication where they were born. Also for her great-grandmother, at the moment I do not have even the surname, so that the search for a MRCA between us is for the moment difficult. However, looking at the DNA-Matches we have in common, because she matches also with my mother, my guess is that the MRCA was most probably in the Marche region, maybe in Ascoli Piceno province or even in Acquasanta Terme or in some small town nearby. In Acquasanta Vol. IV the surname Peri is not present.
Common DNA-Matches
Following table shows the DNA-matches in common between APA and me.
| Name | relationship to me | relationship to AJP | Notes |
|---|---|---|---|
| AMC | Mother (3.534,1 cM / 49,9%) |
5th-9th cousin (26,6 cM, 0,4%) | |
| M. Fazi | 3th-dist. cousin (27,6 cM, 0,4%) |
3th-dist. cousin (9,9 cM, 0,1%) |
I contacted her. No answer so far. |
| MAZ | 3th-dist. cousin (21,2 cM, 0,3%) |
3th-dist. cousin (8,6 cM, 0,1%) |
I contacted her. No answer so far. See also The Azzarello Families. |
| P. Martello | 3th-dist. cousin (13,6 cM, 0,2%) |
3th-dist. cousin (12 cM, 0,2%) |
I contacted him. No answer so far. See also The Martello Families. |
Unfortunately, neither through the common DNA-Matches I can do any guess, but that AJP could be related to me through my mother’s branch.
What is strange, is that a common match we have, namely MAZ, matches… with my father and not with mother like AJP does!